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Open-Source NVIDIA Driver Steps Up Its Game & Runs Much Faster

timothy posted about a month ago | from the when-factors-combine dept.

Graphics 143

An anonymous reader writes "With the Linux 3.16 kernel the Nouveau driver now supports re-clocking for letting the NVIDIA GPU cores and video memory on this reverse-engineered NVIDIA driver run at their designed frequencies. Up to now the Nouveau driver has been handicapped to running at whatever (generally low) clock frequencies the video BIOS programmed the hardware to at boot time, but with Linux 3.16 is experimental support for up-clocking to the hardware-rated speeds. The results show the open-source NVIDIA driver running multiple times faster, but it doesn't work for all NVIDIA hardware, causes lock-ups for some GPUs at some frequencies, and isn't yet dynamically controlled. However, it appears to be the biggest break-through in years for this open-source NVIDIA driver that up to now has been too slow for most Linux games."

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143 comments

THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47287947)

Why? Gaming is HUGE: "WinTendo" anyone (what I see a lot of "open sores" Linux fans call Windows, wrongly imo, but there it is)??

The "year of Linux on the Desktop" we've all heard for a decade++ here isn't out of the question now because of this... you get the games ported to Linux now, more? It gets even closer to becoming a reality.

* Who knows, but I can't help but feel this is a step in the right direction for that to happen!

APK

P.S.=> Yes, I am "the poster child" for Windows fanboy around here - but I can tell the truth/how it is (from my perspective @ least), OR, how it potentially CAN be in Linux' case on these grounds... apk

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288023)

I'm against the rampant indiscriminate prescription of drugs, driven by money thirsty bigpharma.

but I can tell the truth/how it is (from my perspective @ least), you're in need of drugs

"Rinse, Lather, & Repeat" troll (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288383)

Quit projecting your own issues onto me http://linux.slashdot.org/comm... [slashdot.org]

APK

P.S.=> I actually feel sorry for you troll losers to be honest - you project your own problems onto others & try to "spread your misery" to myself and other posters on this forums (since misery loves company)... apk

Re:"Rinse, Lather, & Repeat" troll (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288417)

Quit projecting your own issues onto me http://linux.slashdot.org/comm... [slashdot.org]

APK

P.S.=> I actually feel sorry for you troll losers to be honest - you project your own problems onto others & try to "spread your misery" to myself and other posters on this forums (since misery loves company)... apk

Hey dick-douche why don't you enlighten us all on how a HOSTS FILE can speed up nvidia hardware?

By the way i use my own custom made hosts file - just a text file not your wasteful bigass .exe installable. and i use adblock and noscript and requestpolicy. see good security is done in layers. HOSTS FILES are not the be-all endall. something your obsessive simple mind cannot comprehend. now go share with us all your persecution complex and pat yourself on the back for keeping pure to your obsession, convincing yourself that your every humiliation is somehow a victory.

Adblock BLOWS & hosts aren't the topic (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288593)

See subject-line above, & this (adblock's HUGE mess) https://blog.mozilla.org/nneth... [mozilla.org]

"Almost all ads blocked" (crippled by default) is EASILY detectable via native browser methods as well (for blocking it, which is WHY CLARITYRAY is destroying AdBlock) for dumping what addons you use... hosts, aren't.

APK

P.S.=> Fact: Hosts do more than adblock, ghostery, requestpoclity BY FAR for added speed, security, reliability, + anonymity & more efficiently run by a highly priveleged kernelmode subsystem vs. layering over already SLOWER usermode browsers, increasing message passing overheads + RAM & CPU use (see link above as proof thereof)... apk

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (5, Funny)

PopeRatzo (965947) | about a month ago | (#47288147)

The "year of Linux on the Desktop" we've all heard for a decade++ here isn't out of the question now because of this... you get the games ported to Linux now, more?

Does your choice of operating system preclude your ability to construct sentences in English?

Clearly, you are a native English speaker. What happened to you, lad?

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (4, Funny)

drinkypoo (153816) | about a month ago | (#47288165)

Clearly, you are a native English speaker. What happened to you, lad?

His speech double-plus good.

Obviously, the language of the future will in fact have the double-plusses in it, but it will be missing some articles. This lad is a time-traveler!

Drinkypoo: Being a "ne'er-do-well" troll (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288611)

Is no way to live your life. Why don't YOU *try* to create something useful like I have http://start64.com/index.php?o... [start64.com]

* Is it that you can't, & you know you lack the "intestinal fortitude" to try as well as skills in computing?

APK

P.S.=> You really have issues. Lastly - are you on topic? No... grow up please.

... apk

Re:Drinkypoo: Being a "ne'er-do-well" troll (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | about a month ago | (#47288701)

P.S.=> You really have issues. Lastly - are you on topic? No... grow up please.

YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND TIME CUBE.

"Rinse, Lather, & Repeat", troll... apk (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288805)

"Time Cube" is not the topic here, troll: Grow up, see my subject-line above, & this -> http://linux.slashdot.org/comm... [slashdot.org]

APK

P.S.=> I pity you - I mean, seriously: Do you honestly *think* others will respect you for being an online harasser (troll) of others? I'm surprised you haven't gotten your face smashed in for such reprehensible childish sick behavior on your part... apk

Re:"Rinse, Lather, & Repeat", troll... apk (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288853)

It is a hypercube meaning anything and everything is happening simultaneously, technically speaking this topic is a lie.

Why are you apk still AC (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288989)

why not get an account?

Speak for yourself, hypocrite (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289605)

Posting anonymous coward as you are now... however: I see NO VALUE in it, none (other than being an easily tracked for trolling sheep by posting history).

* :)

What you're proposing would be HIGHLY illogical, just from the results here... & *IF* you think I want to make it easier for trolls to harass me? You are OUTSIDE YOUR MIND...

Besides: I can post ALL I WANT, no /. trackers can trace me (it's the 1 trick I don't "give away" here or EVERY TROLL would use it, & they're certainly not well versed enough in the computer sciences to know how it is done. non-TOR slow, as I do it... they're just too dumb!).

That very same technique allows me to exhaust out their modpoints as well (& I just repost my material they downmod, after they "run outta bullets" in the technically unjustifiable effete retaliatory downmod... get it? Good!)

APK

P.S.=> And, there ya go: The moderators here should be THANKFUL I don't let that little "cat outta the bag" on how I do what I do - this place is outta control enough with trolls as is.. apk

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288173)

he stopped using his drugs

Quit projecting your own issues (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288373)

I don't DO drugs.

APK

P.S.=> They're for losers like you... apk

Re:Quit projecting your own issues (1)

dreamchaser (49529) | about a month ago | (#47288975)

Maybe you should start. If I were you I'd start with anti-psychotics.

You're projecting again (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289677)

Maybe you should get a degree in the psychiatric sciences vs. playing "Dr. Quack: The 'SiDeWaLk-ShRiNk of /.'" (lmao)...

You should also get YEARS-TO-DECADES of professional hands-on experience along with a formal examination of my alleged mental state given in a professional environs rather than libeling myself... you're clearly insane, as you don't consider the potential consequences of your actions & keep repeating the same mistake of attempting to attack me off topic illogically over & over again, which MANY call the very defintion of insanity itself.

Worst of all though: You seem to have delusions of thinking you're a competent practicing psychiatric pro (clue - you're not, so why would anyone listen to the "trolling likes of YOU", the lowest of the LOW online?)

APK

P.S.=> Seriously: That off-topic illogical & effete "line of attack" is mere ad hominem attacks + very stale/old & worn out (like you no doubt)... apk

Re:Quit projecting your own issues (1)

PopeRatzo (965947) | about a month ago | (#47289767)

Don't taunt him. I really don't need to read about another mall shooting.

(I've got $5 that says he's already written at least one manifesto and has a YouTube video about how all women are whores except his grandma)

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (1)

jones_supa (887896) | about a month ago | (#47288199)

Does your choice of operating system preclude your ability to construct sentences in English?

Some people just cannot write properly. Their mind might not be well-suited for it. APK might speak completely fluently face-to-face, but he might not be able to put his thoughts as text as elegantly. I have noticed that some people are like that, or vice versa: that they speak crummily but write perfectly.

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288361)

Is this english class? Are you on topic?

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288543)

Does your choice of operating system preclude your ability to construct sentences in English?

Some people just cannot write properly. Their mind might not be well-suited for it. APK might speak completely fluently face-to-face, but he might not be able to put his thoughts as text as elegantly. I have noticed that some people are like that, or vice versa: that they speak crummily but write perfectly.

In prior discussions APK kept dodging questions about whether or not he has been diagnosed as mentally ill in some way by a psychologist or psychiatrist. He never would say yes or no to that one. All he did was keep repeating that the person asking was not themselves a shrink - a fact no one was disputing. Very dodgy. The whole subject seemed to be a sore point for him in fact.

I'm sure he'll chime in and tell me all about his "victory" over me even though I personally have never argued with him before. He does that a lot.

No, I don't avoid questions... apk (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288577)

I've never been diagnosed as having mental illness etc. - you have, in projecting your issues as you are now attempting to put them onto me.

I'm 100% sane.

Now - are you on topic? Is this english class??

APK

P.S.=> I'm on topic, you're not & you're an off topic troll with delusions of grandeur @ being a psychiatric pro, when in reality, all you are is "Dr. Quack: 'SiDeWaLk-ShRinK of /.'"... apk

Re:No, I don't avoid questions... apk (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289477)

I've never been diagnosed as having mental illness etc.

If you're not evaluated by any medic of course you'll never be "diagnosed".

I'm 100% sane.

That's what you think. Your actions say otherwise.

Now - are you on topic?

He was on topic. You are the topic. When you seek metal help you'll stop being the topic.

Why go to any doctor if I am not sick? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289597)

Never having to be diagnosed (like you) ISs indicative of health, stupid (both mental & physical) - obviously unlike your "projecting" loonybird self!

See subject-line: I don't *need* to see them (you obviously do, & have... lol!) - only an illogical fool like yourself does that, especially in mental health related terms!

* :)

By the way - I don't keep repeating the same mistake over & over expecting different results (you & "your kind", the lowest of the LOW online in trolling scum always do), which I completely & EASILY floor you with your "illogic logic" (lol) going off-topic, using illogical ad hominem attacks, & perhaps MOST OF ALL considering yourselves to be competent professional degreed & licensed psychiatric pros...

You've got SERIOUS "delusions of grandeur" in that alone, & repeating your mistake of attacking me + failing as usual on your end is the very definition of insanity itself on YOUR part - especially "projecting" as you do, nigh constantly.

APK

P.S.=> Face it - you WISH you were ME...

... apk

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (2)

snakeplissken (559127) | about a month ago | (#47289001)

In prior discussions APK kept dodging questions about whether or not he has been diagnosed as mentally ill in some way by a psychologist or psychiatrist. He never would say yes or no to that one

and why in arse cunting fuck should he? what business is that of anyone about anyone on here?

Thanks Snake... apk (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289729)

They're just trolls I've dusted before & this is "the best they got" in effete off-topic illogical ad hominem attacks & what-not exemplified here by their stupidity is all...

* Quite the "fanclub" I've got here, eh? Lmao...

(They're amusing & easily dispatched with their own stupidity though, thank goodness for that... as you can see, they're not TOO intelligent, & certainly "ne'er-do-wells" that project their own issues as they attempt to put those selfsame issues onto ME is all - very easily seen through, & it makes me wonder if their FAVORITE COLOR is "transparent"...)

By the way: One of my fav. films of the Sci-Fi dystopian future genre in your nickname/ handle here - he's "my kind of guy" that Snake ("call me snake").

APK

P.S.=> In any event, thanks for telling one of them off... it's appreciated man... apk

Re:Thanks Snake... apk (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289789)

P.S.=> In any event, thanks for telling one of them off... it's appreciated man... apk

Just because you don't sign some of your posts doesn't mean we can't tell it is still you posting. You have too many compositional tells.

Learn to read (I don't do reg'd user here) (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47290049)

This post is by registered user SnakePlissken telling you off http://linux.slashdot.org/comm... [slashdot.org] & I *definitely* DO NOT USE a registered user acc't. here... why? I was asked WHY, & said why, here in this very exchange -> http://linux.slashdot.org/comm... [slashdot.org]

* You SERIOUSLY need to get out your "hooked on phonics"...

(That, OR other remedial reading aids since you didn't see that I did not post that 1st link (where snake told you to basically "f" off...))

APK

P.S.=> I must ask: How BADLY did I dust you in a tech debate before this (when you must've thought "you knew it all" & I outright SCHOOLED YOU) that your "geek angst" is "up" so much that you must troll me (attempting to harass me, & failing) off-topic + illogically with your ad hominem attacks?

Come on, lol:

It's SO painfully obvious, you're worse than a jilted woman for Pete's sake (lol, seriously) - & YOUR FAVORITE COLOR must be "transparent", since I see RIGHT thru you, easily (so did snakeplissken & others reading obviously)... apk

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288353)

What you quoted is called a rhetorical question. Don't you know how to recognize that?

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288399)

Is this english class? Are you on topic??

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288821)

The "year of Linux on the Desktop" we've all heard for a decade++ here isn't out of the question now because of this... you get the games ported to Linux now, more?

Does your choice of operating system preclude your ability to construct sentences in English?

Clearly, you are a native English speaker. What happened to you, lad?

Chronic masturbation would be my guess. It's difficult to type with only one hand.

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288839)

You're projecting again.

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288203)

Stop impersonating me you troll.

APK

Grow up (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288343)

Seriously. Don't you have better things to do?

APK

P.S.=> You're truly pitiful: I can't even dislike you since you're obviously trying to spread your misery to others (in myself). However, that "ain't happenin'".

I mean, come on: Trying to "impersonate" me - you obviously don't have a life, and what you do have is your personal internal misery... well, you won't find any company here @ least! apk

Re:Grow up (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288995)

It's trolls like you and your pathetic spamming of your silly HOSTS file who are riddled with personal internal misery. What a sad, sad existence you must live if your validation comes from anonymously spamming Slashdot with your rantings and drivel. You are truly pathetic.

-Not APK (Thank the Gods)

I only post on hosts where they apply (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289649)

Vs. clearly INFERIOR competitors (browser addons), vs. malware & the like, or for shoring up DNS security issues... prove otherwise.

Going to quote a favorite of mine from Marvel Comics, in Ultron 6 here (soon to be the star of the next installment of "The Avengers" films upcoming in 2015 on this note & your "orders"...):

"Shutdown code, rejected: My programming ( http://start64.com/index.php?o... [start64.com] ) has advanced beyond YOUR commands: Beyond YOUR weakness https://blog.mozilla.org/nneth... [mozilla.org] " - Ultron 6 FROM -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?f... [youtube.com]

* :)

He says it BETTER than I ever could... as far as your bullshit.

APK

P.S.=> I am also NOT selling anything - it can't be "spam" then either, & you trolls MOST CERTAINLY cannot validly technically disprove my points on hosts giving users FAR MORE BENEFITS in added speed, security, reliability, & even anonymity than ANY other single slower usermode crippled & 'souled-out' browser addons (vs. hosts kernelmode HIGHLY priveleged operations' superior speed + efficiency with over 45++ yrs. of optimization poured into the IP stack itself, of which hosts are a std. part of)... that's that - fact: There's nothing you can do to stop me either (lol, & you know it)... apk

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (3, Insightful)

thsths (31372) | about a month ago | (#47288465)

No, the year of the Linux desktop is over.

We used to have Gnome 2, KDE 2 and 3, OpenOffice, Mozilla, Flash Player and many useful tools against Windows XP. It was superior technology, but the impact was limited (LiMuX?).

OpenOffice is in ruins (and hardly better than 10 years ago), the Gnome community is split, and KDE keeps getting fatter. Meanwhile Windows 7 is a half decent operating system, and Office 2007 has upped the game considerably. Even Google targets Linux only for some of their products.

The battle for the desktop is over and lost.

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288517)

My anecdotal evidence says otherwise. We'll find out the truth in some years.

1st of all: Thanks for being "on topic" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288655)

As you can see, my legions of "ne'er-do-well" trolls with delusions of grandeur @ being English PhD's + psychiatric pros (complete with illogical off topic ad hominem attacks etc./et al) are out in full force today...

NOW, to answer you: You know, I've *tried* Linux (last time was in 2010 for the entire summer while I was in europe) on a laptop... it worked, but some updates hosed it for me. Other than that, it was COMPLETELY usable for most things I do (especially when I found Lazarus & FreePascal worked well, taking the place of the now extinct Kylix product from Borland... ports of code were easy enough too (well, some IP stack differences, drive letters vs. mounted disks, etc. were some "catch-22's" I had to adjust some apps I did for Windows for is all mostly really).

HOWEVER - THAT IS MY VERY POINT & those of my best buddy Jack who tried it too when XP went dead for support... he ran into things he could do on Windows he couldn't on Linux... GAMING was a "HUGE" one for him.

It's the very thing that drives folks back to Windows imo & experience (That, & sound or printing issues) + yes, those of others I know... we all LIKED it well enough, but hit "snags"...

It's only a matter of time though before those issues get ironed out... I even told ForeDecker (Richard Russell, former VP of Microsoft's "Windows Client Performance Division" by email that it's only a matter of TIME before Linux becomes a threat to Windows, yes, on the desktop... Windows, imo, is "peaking" & only security patching's really needed now, but as far as features + drivers, it's clearly ahead of Linux in the areas I noted...)

APK

P.S.=> Still, with moves like this article alludes to? It's only a matter of time before Linux *DOES* become an actual threat to Windows (biggest one of all is it has NO COST, thus, keeping per unit sales of PC's down vs. Windows which adds costs)... apk

Re:THIS is a potentially "huge score" for Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289239)

No, the year of the Linux desktop is over.

On this, I agree..it'll never happen for a number of reasons, the primary one being people are sheep.
You might find that statement a wee bit too strong, but let's face it, humanity, on the whole can be led around like a bunch of sheep. Humans are, after all, descended from, um, troop animals, you've just got to know which psychological buttons to push to control them.

We used to have Gnome 2, KDE 2 and 3, OpenOffice, Mozilla, Flash Player and many useful tools against Windows XP. It was superior technology, but the impact was limited (LiMuX?).

They weren't tools against XP per se, that was the problem IMHO, people saw it as a great battle, us vs 'Them' for control of the world's desktops. It wasn't, could never have been anyways thanks to the amount of money involved on the 'Them' side (vested interests, vested interests everywhere, and at every level), we managed to get some people to switch, or at least see that there were other alternatives to the Microsoft hedgemony..it ain't our fault if the rest of humanity chose to ignore our advice.

OpenOffice is in ruins (and hardly better than 10 years ago),

And?, ok, I'll accept that for a given value of ruin (horrible, horrible code), but I'll tell you what, it works, and I can knock up a formatted document faster in OO or LO faster than our secretary can in Word 2007.

the Gnome community is split,

Good, then again, I never liked Gernome..

and KDE keeps getting fatter.

Tell me about it, on this machine KDE 3.x flew, KDE 4 struggles along..unfortunately as it has to be a stock install of Debian (for political/support reasons) so I'm stuck with it.
Thank FSM for Xfce..

Meanwhile Windows 7 is a half decent operating system,

Half arsed, I think is the phrase you're looking for there old chap...
Admittedly, it's better than 8, but it still won't run a lot of my software without issues/at all. Even though my main Windows desktop machine exceeds the minimum spec for Win7, it runs it like a dog, so I'll be sticking to XP on it as I can't afford to shell out for new hardware, and newer versions of the software I use on a daily/regular basis which will run under Win7.

Please note, I *do* have an overspecced Win7 box, it runs no AV software (performance hit was too much, don't get me started about disk fragmentation the AV shit introduced..), isn't online (see no AV software), and is purely to run specific CAD/CAM software. The risible thing with this box is that running tests against the older version of the software running on an XP box (half the cores, quarter the memory AND running AV software) with the same graphics card, rendering the same design on it is a lot slower on the Win7 box.

and Office 2007 has upped the game considerably.

What game? the game of 'hey people were getting too used to the interface, let's fuck with it..'
At work, we were on Office 2003, the only thing upped with the introduction of 2007 was calls to support along the lines of 'how the feck do I do this?' and 'can I have the old office back?'

Even Google targets Linux only for some of their products.

And?, is this such a great loss in the grand scheme of things?

The battle for the desktop is over and lost.

It is, and my cat has won...oh, wait, you mean computer desktop?

Same old, same old (lol)... apk (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288825)

The unjustifable downmod after trolling/harassing me completely off-topic w/ forums' "illogic logic" via off topic illogical ad hominem attacks directed my way by ac posts from trolling "ne'er-do-wells" (mostly), & then the inevitable unjustifiable downmod of my post...

* It almost BOGGLES THE MIND that there are human beings that LIVE to cause others grief or try to, online & otherwise... but there you have it.

APK

P.S.=> Predictable, & repeating the same mistakes over AND over again, expecting different results (and they insinuate I am 'insane', on drugs, etc. - et al? Please... lmao!)

... apk

Re:Same old, same old (lol)... apk (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289101)

and they insinuate I am 'insane', on drugs

Quite the opposite. You are insane. But you're off of drugs. That's the whole point, you should be taking drugs to relief your mind, to get out of the dark place you're currently on.

Now seriously, perhaps you don't need drugs, but you do need at least some counseling. Talk to a therapist, in the worst case you'll only lose time and some bucks, but you most probably will feel much better.

Do you possess the following? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289577)

1.) A license to practice in the psychiatric sciences
2.) A PhD in those psychiatric sciences
3.) Years to decades of hands on professional practice in those self-same psychiatric sciences (and most importantly/lastly)
4.) A formal examination given by competent psychiatric professionals in a professional psychiatric environment

?

No?? Of course not... you've got "delusions of grandeur" thinking you qualify to judge ANYONE on those grounds!

Most importantly perhaps, is the fact you keep repeating the same mistake (trying to vainly take me on with off-topic illogical ad hominem attacks & failing) over & over again - which SOME call the very defintion of insanity (on YOUR part)... lmao!
APK

P.S.=> You're merely "Dr. Quack: The 'SiDeWaLk-ShRiNk of /.'" the wannabe psychiatric professional, lol... apk

Re:Do you possess the following? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289787)

I don't need to have medical training to see a dog with rotting flesh and know it needs to be taken to a veterinarian.

You see, you are the dog. Your mind is rotting. And damn your words stink. Anybody far away from you can clearly see you're in need of medical attention.

And it is at the same time funny and sad that you think all AC posts came from only one person. Please get treatment, urgently.

Re:Do you possess the following? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47290071)

No. You, specifically, need to take your meds! It's obvious you're way past your regular interval, psycho as well as your constantly projecting you see psychoanalysts and what not in this exchange.

Re:Do you possess the following? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47290075)

Hahahahahaha. Good one.

Re:Do you possess the following? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47290105)

mental cases such as yourself are not considered credible witnesses

Re:Do you possess the following? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47290021)

1.) A license to practice in the psychiatric sciences 2.) A PhD in those psychiatric sciences 3.) Years to decades of hands on professional practice in those self-same psychiatric sciences (and most importantly/lastly) 4.) A formal examination given by competent psychiatric professionals in a professional psychiatric environment

Yes.

You're suffering from psychosis, specifically paranoid delusions. You require medical help.

Re:Do you possess the following? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47290087)

You've got delusions of grandeur thinking you're a psychiatric pro. Go take your meds now http://linux.slashdot.org/comm... [slashdot.org] like a good boy (lol).

Overclocking is Recommended? (0)

wisnoskij (1206448) | about a month ago | (#47287953)

So based on this article it sounds like overclocking your video card is something everyone should do?
And NVIDIA is a pretty big name. This article is saying that all of htere cards are too slow without overclocking to play most Linux games?

No overclocking (4, Informative)

dutchwhizzman (817898) | about a month ago | (#47287959)

This isn't about overclocking. Most GPUs get set to a power saving speed for boot that is way below their maximal factory rated capacity. A 1GHz GPU could well be clocked at 300MHz or even lower during boot by the BIOS settings.

Re:No overclocking (3, Informative)

drinkypoo (153816) | about a month ago | (#47288053)

This isn't about overclocking. Most GPUs get set to a power saving speed for boot that is way below their maximal factory rated capacity. A 1GHz GPU could well be clocked at 300MHz or even lower during boot by the BIOS settings.

And it's a damned good thing, too. When clocked lower and only displaying text the GPU is using the absolute lowest amount of power. If you're having problems with PCIE VRM (badcaps!) then the system will often come up to the GUI and then fail, but you can still use the text interface to troubleshoot, for example changing BIOS settings around and the like while chasing the problem.

Will this make the Firefox fast on the Linux? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288161)

Good Day Sir,

I am new to the Linux. I use the Firefox on my the Linux PC. I detect that the Linux is fast but the Firefox is slow. I am ask you will the new driver for the Linux fix the slow I have detected with the Firefox?

Your Friend And Colleague,
Srindihar

Re:Will this make the Firefox fast on the Linux? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288331)

will the new driver for the Linux fix the slow I have detected with the Firefox?

No. Firefox is slow because you are connected to the Internet with a 56K modem. A faster GPU won't fix that.

Re:Will this make the Firefox fast on the Linux? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288371)

I said GOOD DAY!

Re:Will this make the Firefox fast on the Linux? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289137)

I have the same issue with firefox and IE on windows 7 while flash player is installed. Remove flash player and your firefox will run smoother otherwise use chrome.

Re:Will this make the Firefox fast on the Linux? (1)

epyT-R (613989) | about a month ago | (#47289739)

The firefox is always slow. It has been slow since it was the netscape.

Beware not to overheat your GPU/Memory (1)

La Gris (531858) | about a month ago | (#47288833)

It's a very good start but until they can manage dynamic clocking, proper monitoring of GPU, RAM and PCB temperature, and then adjust fan speeds or fallback lower in case of overheat, you are better be very careful with this recent feature.

Re:Beware not to overheat your GPU/Memory (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289295)

It's only coming up to factory rated at the moment; that's not going to cause problems unless the fan is failing in the first place.

For example, my 560Ti has 3 configured clock speeds in windows. P0 (the slowest and default) is just 51MHz. P1 is about 400MHz, and P2 (performance) is 830MHz.

Under the previous linux driver, this would have been stuck running at 51MHz, even though the manufacturer knows and has certified that it is safe to run at 830MHz (for reference, the hottest it gets at that higher frequency is 62'c). That's a huge difference in performance potential, and will not cause overheating problems unless the system is badly built or maintained in the first place.

Frankly, if someone's competent enough to have a Linux box with a high performance GPU, I'd expect them to have done their reading and have proper power and cooling in place.

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47287979)

Wrong the article says "running your graphics card in low power energy saving state is not the optimal choice if the card is not idle but actually needs to work".

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (2)

GNious (953874) | about a month ago | (#47287991)

BIOSes would generally set it to a default, low clock-speed.
This is for setting it to the proper (non-overclocked) speed.

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (1)

wisnoskij (1206448) | about a month ago | (#47288819)

Why would the BIOS underclock it to something below the recommended speed?
Are you implying that the proprietary drivers for Linux and Windows default to overclocking to this "proper" speed?

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289335)

More or less, that's exactly what happens.

The card's official drivers will have multiple known good power states configured - a low power, low performance configuration for an idle desktop, a high power, high performance mode for demanding games or CAD/CAM work, and something in the middle for older titles that don't need the cards full performance potential. This is what the 'adaptive' and 'prefer maximum performance' options in nvidia's windows drivers refer to.

For mine, under windows, these modes are 51Mhz, 405Mhz, and 830Mhz. With a monitoring program up (nvidia inspector) I can actually track the card stepping between these performance modes as the demands on it change. For example, at desktop it's at 51MHz. If I load chrome, I can see the card step up to 830MHz in anticipation of a high load as chrome loads its assets into video memory. Then that steps down to 405mhz as the driver realises there's no continuing load, then back down to 51Mhz a few seconds later, as the load is so low that even the 405Mhz mode is overkill.

When the machine's starting, the card isn't going to have any load placed on it. Therefore, it makes sense to start it using the low-power configuration.

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (1)

radarskiy (2874255) | about a month ago | (#47289747)

The BIOS has safe default settings that do not require active monitoring or even knowing the ambient temperature. (Consider a laptop that had been left an a car overnight during winter. When booting you need to have high voltage and low frequency to get it to initially work. That is not necessarily a typical condition, but the system when booting does not know anything yet.)

Once the driver is running it can start adjusting things to account for ambient temperature, work load, relative usage of other system components, etc. However, not this from the summary "isn't yet dynamically controlled". That means that the driver had the ability now to change the frequency, but does not yet have the monitoring to do it safely.

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (1)

epyT-R (613989) | about a month ago | (#47289751)

The chip is specced to run at a specific speed.. when the full performance is not needed, the drivers underclock it to save power and heat. same is true for the ram on the card too. Voltages and memory timings also scale too, which might be why some cards are having trouble at their highest settings. Nouveau might not set the right timings and voltages for those clocks.

So technically the card is not 'overclocked' unless it's run beyond the manufacturer set top speed and voltage.

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | about a month ago | (#47288019)

So based on this article it sounds like overclocking your video card is something everyone should do?

As the sibling comment says, that's not what the article says at all.

With that said, yes, overclocking your video card is something pretty much everyone should do. Video cards are now typically sold with considerable headroom, and manufacturers actually bundle overclocking tools with the cards. Whether the idea here is to stop throwing away low-binned GPUs or to make customers feel better about their purchases, either way you do want to overclock your video card. I got one extra FPS out of furmark at 1920x1200 on a 450GTS (cheap used, relatively low power budget.)

Unfortunately, this card either can't be overclocked on Linux, or I need another driver. Whether I set coolbits to 1, 4, 5, 12, 13 or whatever, I never get overclocking options. So I guess I won't be buying any linux games which have fancy graphics. I can only use the full power of my system under windows.

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288133)

Tux Racer is awesome! Show it to your MSFT Windoze friends and watch their jaws drop!

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (1)

jones_supa (887896) | about a month ago | (#47288139)

Unfortunately, this card either can't be overclocked on Linux, or I need another driver. Whether I set coolbits to 1, 4, 5, 12, 13 or whatever, I never get overclocking options. So I guess I won't be buying any linux games which have fancy graphics. I can only use the full power of my system under windows.

Then why do you use Linux? I always choose the operating system which allows me to utilize my hardware to the greatest extent. Right now I'm using Linux, because in this case I get higher OpenGL support for the old Intel gen4 hardware.

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (2)

drinkypoo (153816) | about a month ago | (#47288183)

Then why do you use Linux?

I use Linux when I want to do secure things, like banking. I don't trust Microsoft to handle paypal, let alone online banking. I use windows when I want to play games. The right tool for the job. I will do some light surfing on Windows with firefox, noscript, ghostery, adblock plus, but I don't trust it* with anything important, e.g. if I see something I want to eBay I will go ahead and log into eBay so I can buy it, but I stop short of entering my paypal password and I go handle the payment later, when I'm booted into Linux.

( * OK, I trust Windows enough to dual-boot and keep the HDD connected. I suppose a malicious worm could read ext. As soon as I get this other PC recapped I'm going to move my linux disk there and it will be a non-issue.)

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47289163)

Setup your user account as standard(not administrator) and set the UAC(user account control) all the way up, have an anti-virus like MS essentials installed and you will be fine. This setup is almost same as linux security. With linux, the user is standard(limited access) and no application can install without your permission. You can setup a second account as administrator just in case the first one gets corrupt or something.

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (1)

loufoque (1400831) | about a month ago | (#47288117)

There is a high quality proprietary driver made by NVIDIA.
This is about an alternative open-source driver made by hobbyists which is much slower than the real thing.

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (1)

wisnoskij (1206448) | about a month ago | (#47288811)

And the article states that the reason it is slower is because it does not overclock the card by a factor or two or three. Or maybe it is making up for being so slow by overclocking the card?

Either way the article is stating. "NVidia Linux users, your graphical woes are over. Download this update and overclock your card to many times its original speed". I am asking if that advice is good advice? If 2X-overclocking a graphics card just something everyone with an NVidia card should do?

Re:Overclocking is Recommended? (1)

CronoCloud (590650) | about a month ago | (#47288847)

The summary is misleading. It's not about overclocking at all, but actually letting your NVidia card run at full speed under Nouveau. See, Nouveau doesn't have the ability to dynamically set your GPU's clock, so it boots in the normal low power state and then can never go up, no matter what.

Using the proprietary driver, the card is clocked based upon graphics needs.

Under Nouveau say, a GT640 rev 2 would always run at 405Mhz, NOT the full 1124 Mhz even if you ran a 3D using application. Using the proprietary driver, if you're just browsing the web and then start up something uses 3D it'll ramp right up to full speed.

Great News for the Developers! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47287967)

Sounds great, but definitely still a use at your own risk sort of thing until more is known about the clock management and the specific capabilities of each card is added to a table in the driver code.

I hope this means 2015 will be the year of FOSS desktop gaming!

Performance vs Closed source driver? (4, Interesting)

nonsequitor (893813) | about a month ago | (#47288039)

Kudos to the Nouveau team for reaching this exciting milestone!

If they tested side by side with the closed source driver from Nvidia, where does this put them in terms of performance?

How long until an average user will chose the nouveau driver over the closed source driver, if said user doesn't care about licensing or building from source, but is looking for out of the box performance? Where does that put them in comparison with the Nvidia driver on Windows?

Personally, this project is not very relevant to me since I have no qualms about using the closed source driver which is good enough for my purposes, but I'm not a gamer. I really hope someone like Valve is sponsoring this development because it sounds like a lot of tedious, hard work to be doing pro bono.

Re:Performance vs Closed source driver? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288193)

For older cards, perhaps in a few years. But for newer cards, with the rate of technology and the closed nature of the bussiness, probably never. Take GCC for example, it's great but it still tends to get it's ass handed to it by the ICC for heavy benchmarks (on Intel CPUs of course).

Re:Performance vs Closed source driver? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288269)

Yet there are most likely expontentially more companies shipping products built with gcc than with ICC. Perhaps you should have chosen a better example.

Re: Performance vs Closed source driver? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288671)

"ICC for heavy benchmarks". Heheheh! A crooked compiler for benchmarks? What are we benchmarking - Intel corporate ethics?

Re:Performance vs Closed source driver? (3, Interesting)

Savage-Rabbit (308260) | about a month ago | (#47288259)

How long until an average user will chose the nouveau driver over the closed source driver, if said user doesn't care about licensing or building from source, but is looking for out of the box performance?

When it is stable? The damn thing kept crashing on me one or two times a day which is why I switched to the proprietary driver. Now I'm back to using the Nouveau driver with a new Nvidia card and it only crashes one or two times a month which is just about stable enough to not make me bother with the proprietary one.

Where does that put them in comparison with the Nvidia driver on Windows?

The Windows driver is somewhat more stable, I regard stability as an aspect of performance.

Re:Performance vs Closed source driver? (1)

Undead Waffle (1447615) | about a month ago | (#47290019)

In the past I've primarily used Nvidia cards and always used the closed source drivers because they were so much better.

Now I have an AMD card and was having performance problems. I found out that the open source drivers for AMD are better than the proprietary ones.

So I consider it relevant just for the simplicity of the overall system. New users shouldn't have to research whether the proprietary driver is better than the open source one for their card. It's better for the success of Linux when things just work out of the box, and right now the box contains the open source drivers. Personally I think it was not very smart of them to ship with these drivers in the first place until they were mature enough, but that's where we are.

OT but Nouveau, any NV2A progress? (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | about a month ago | (#47288141)

I know that NV2A is a lumpy problem, but I'd sure like to know if there's been any progress on that front. I googled around a little bit and didn't see anything, but that is hardly an exhaustive search. My understanding was that someone was going to have to get passionate about the project to move it forwards, and I suppose that's unlikely to happen now, but there's still a lot of 360s out there in the world and they still have 720p/1080i and digital audio out, they're a pretty decent display box.

Re:OT but Nouveau, any NV2A progress? (1)

jonwil (467024) | about a month ago | (#47288305)

I think you mean original xboxes. The 360 has an ATI GPU, not NVIDIA.

Re:OT but Nouveau, any NV2A progress? (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | about a month ago | (#47288327)

I think you mean original xboxes. The 360 has an ATI GPU, not NVIDIA.

Yes I do, sorry. I have three of them here still, I think. At least two. My 360 is on my mind because last time I wanted to use it (last night) I instead got to make several hundred megabytes of updates, between the OS and GTAV with two required (free) content packs, and then it hung. Probably I should crack it again, de-dust it, and apply new thermal compound. Now, where is my arctic silver?

Re:OT but Nouveau, any NV2A progress? (1)

goarilla (908067) | about a month ago | (#47289105)

Now, where is my arctic silver?

I always wonder, is there an expiration date on thermal paste. I keep buying new ones because I don't know and it's cheap.

Re:OT but Nouveau, any NV2A progress? (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | about a month ago | (#47289397)

I always wonder, is there an expiration date on thermal paste. I keep buying new ones because I don't know and it's cheap.

Well, it only lasts so long when applied, but I assume that it will last longer before application, while still in the syringe. If it's in a plasti-packet, then I assume that it will go bad about as quickly as applied compound, although it will probably take longer than that due to decreased thermal cycling.

Why didn't I hear about this before? (2)

jones_supa (887896) | about a month ago | (#47288187)

I'm glad that it got fixed, but why haven't I ever before heard about this constrainment in the Nouveau driver? Once again, were the open source propellerheads so excited about open source, that they never honestly mentioned this glooming limitation in any discussions? :(

What next? "Oh, we forgot to mention that all vertex shaders have been software-emulated in Mesa for the last 10 years. Well, we've finally fixed it."

Why didn't I hear about this before? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288293)

From the front page of the nouveau wiki (http://nouveau.freedesktop.org/wiki/):

"""
Performance level selection (also known as "reclocking") is not supported yet. Expect low 3D performance on laptops using a Tesla GPU and all Fermi/Kepler cards. (see CodeNames)
"""

So... don't know why you haven't heard it before... perhaps you don't look for things?

Re:Why didn't I hear about this before? (1)

complete loony (663508) | about a month ago | (#47288375)

Lots of phoronix blog posts have made it to the front page of slashdot and talked about this exact issue. It's only recently that the open source drivers have been gaining momentum and becoming usable for gaming on most GPU's. But they've been fine for desktop work for ages.

Re:Why didn't I hear about this before? (1)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | about a month ago | (#47288403)

As the anon says, it's been stated on Nouveau's website for ages. Similarly, googling for "nouveau reclocking" or similar shows plenty of posts and websites dating at least to 30.1.2012. So basically, it's been discussed a lot, it's been discussed even here on Slashdot, and you've just missed the whole thing. Calling others "propellerheads" for your failures isn't quite fair.

Re:Why didn't I hear about this before? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288625)

It's been mentioned before, in one or two stories here on slashdot. I even believe a kernel changelog mentioned this.

Re:Why didn't I hear about this before? (0)

ledow (319597) | about a month ago | (#47288657)

Please don't lose sight of the real problem:

If nVidia just pulled their finger out and gave these guys proper documentation, or at least a hint, or a hand, or maybe even some damn code, things would have moved HUNDREDS OF TIMES FASTER.

These people are finding out how to do this stuff by probing the card, listening to what the driver does, and that's all extremely low-level stuff on undocumented chips.

The fact it works AT ALL is because these guys are fucking good at what they do and are trying extremely hard. It's not just a case of slapping a debugger on a low-level driver like this, as the interaction with system buses and the entirely unknown instruction sets and memory maps make ANY probing and testing extremely time-consuming and liable to damage stuff.

Or nVidia could just say "Here you go, guys, the reason you couldn't do this before is X and you just need to initiliase Y before you probe Z..."

Re:Why didn't I hear about this before? (1)

zequav (2700007) | about a month ago | (#47289021)

Nouveau *did* have reclocking for several cards before. I used to be able to reclock my 450GTS and 460GTX without any problems with something like:

# echo 3 > /sys/class/drm/card0/device/performance_level

but since kernel 3.11 or 3.12 (I don't remember) they changed the interface to the new yadda/yadda/pstate, and we lost the reclocking ability for the last 3 or 4 kernel versions. I wish they had waited until they had something functional to remove something that (at least for some of us) worked fine.

So is it safe to buy a computer... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288235)

With a NVIDA graphics card now? I will run Linux on it, and in the past, I've always stuck to Intel (Integrated graphics) because it just worked. I don't want to install proprietary drivers. I'm no gamer, but a graphics card could definitely help with watching movies (I have the disposable income, so couldn't hurt). I just have heard terrible things about both AMD and NVIDA in the past on Linux.

So assuming money isn't an option and I won't install proprietary drivers out of principle, which is better, NVIDA or Intel?

Driver broken on other platforms? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a month ago | (#47288285)

With the innovation of linux 3.16 only.. does this mean that nvidia drivers are now broken like AMD/ATI drivers on other operating systems? *BSD user here and I need a video card that works.

Sorry but... (2)

JustNiz (692889) | about a month ago | (#47288647)

Even though this is a good step in the right direction, Nouveau still isn't even stable enough for general consumption, let alone seriously competitive with features or performance of nVidia's binary-only driver.

It annoys the heck out of me that Mint switched to installing nouveau by default and especially without any alternative graphics driver option at install time, as on my laptop at least, as soon as Nouveau starts it crashes and locks up the whole PC. Trendy political correctness for (broken) open source shouldn't ever trump a binary driver if it actually works better, or especialy if it is the only option that works at all in some cases.

Add on top of that the fact that Mint devs also removed Ubuntu's boot menu option to install Linux before X starts, means the retarded decision to use nouveau by default makes it impossible for me and presumably therefore many others to install Mint from scratch without some obscure and what should be completely unnecessary hacking every time.

If even just installing Mint is borked, its really going to put off people who are trying Linux for the first time.

Re:Sorry but... (0)

Arker (91948) | about a month ago | (#47289049)

So you happen to have one of the cards it crashes on. I can understand being annoyed by that.

But look at the big picture, please. The binary driver is a buggy POS on any system, and will never be anything else. The nouveau driver gives a viable way to support this hardware properly. Sure it still crashes on some cards. Bug reports are needed to identify the issues and fix them. The point here is this is software that CAN be fixed, unlike a binary that cant even be USED in many cases, let alone fixed.

"Add on top of that the fact that Mint devs also removed Ubuntu's boot menu option to install Linux before X starts,"

Well ok that part of it is truly retarded, I agree. Requiring X for your installer is a real rookie move and it's hilarious how many supposedly competent distros fall for it.

Re:Sorry but... (1)

JustNiz (692889) | about a month ago | (#47289583)

>> The binary driver is a buggy POS on any system, and will never be anything else.

No it really isn't. i run it on several linux boxes all with different nVidia GPUs and they all work perfectly. By which I mean I've NEVER seen a crash using the nVidia Linux driver.

Novueau crashes all the time. On my laptop especailyl I can't even start it.

Re:Sorry but... (-1)

Arker (91948) | about a month ago | (#47289615)

"No it really isn't. i run it on several linux boxes"

Not surprising with a small sample and homogenous hardware, and not particularly meaningful either. Others find it much less reliable.

Now try just getting it to work, forget about not crashing, but to work at all on a new kernel, or a new architecture. It aint happening.

This is what happens when you accept non-free drivers. Maybe, absolute best case, it works fine for a subset of users. It will never serve the rest, and we will never be able to fix its bugs, extend it, improve it, or maintain it. If you use it you lose the ability to upgrade or improve your own system as well.

Far too high a price to pay for fancy graphics. But fortunately you dont have to pay that price. Nouveau is more than good enough for most people right now (much like the blob) but it does not share the long-term disabilities.

Personally I have found that AMD and Nvidia usually work well enough for me using real drivers, and Intel works flawlessly. Intel has sold a few more units as a result. Good to see nouveau making progress though, it's always good to have more choices.

Re:Sorry but... (1)

JustNiz (692889) | about a month ago | (#47289779)

>> Not surprising with a small sample and homogenous hardware,

You need to take a look around the internet. Its not just me, there are many different articles supporting that the nvidia binary drivers perform much better than nouveau. I can't even find one supporting nouveau over nvidia's own for stability and performance.

I do agree that trying to get a binary driver for one architecture working on another architecture would be crazy. Don't get me wrong, I totally support the idea of open source drivers for that and many other reasons, and I do very much wish nVidia would opensource theirs, or at least dedicate some significant engineering resource into making noveau as good or better than their own Linux drivers.

For me and the many others that just want their Linux boxes to work, rather than people who actually want to tweak broken driver code, or put up with consistent poor performance and crashes to make some ideological point, choosing to install nvidia's own binary driver over nouveau is currently a no-brainer.

The Mint devs need to get a grip on the fact that most of its users do just want their box to work instead of by default geting the philosophically more pure but actually way more broken driver.

Re:Sorry but... (0)

Arker (91948) | about a month ago | (#47289919)

"I can't even find one supporting nouveau over nvidia's own for stability and performance."

And you are still pretending it provides that? When you just admitted it wont even compile? How do you maintain such doublethink without snapping something inside?

Seriously, out one side of your mouth you pretend to acknowledge the points I just made, but out of the other you blather on about the 'superiority' of a solution we just established flat out does not work.

And then you deride their efforts to put out a system that actually has a proper driver for your hardware, as somehow 'philosophically pure?' I am not sure why that would be a bad thing but it's ludicrously out of place anyway. Real drivers should always be preferred precisely because the end goal is to practical - ensuring we can make our boxes work, today and tomorrow.

As we just established, you absolutely cannot do that with a binary.
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